Tigers mythbuster: Pre-Bowden Clemson was a wreck

By Marc Hudgens  |   Sunday, July 06, 2008  |  Comments( 22 )

 Clemson Tigers
Among many falsehoods talked about by Clemson fans is the notion that Tigers head coach Tommy Bowden has struggled to win an ACC title because he inherited a program that was a shambles. Admittedly, the Tiger program during the Ken Hatfield and Tommy West years wasn't anything to brag about, but that doesn't mean Clemson football was a complete ...
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CommentsComments: 22
 No.1
swingaway		 08:24 AM
07/07/2008
The cupboard was pretty bare, as evidenced by the following numbers:

1.) The first two Hatfield years (with Ford players) had records of 10-2 and 9-3. Remove those years due to Ford's players and the Hatfield/West record would not be 63-41-1 but instead 44-36-1. 8 games over .500 for a 7 year period is pretty bad.

2.) The last year of West era, we were 3-8 and 1-7 in conference with losses to a 4-7 Duke team and 3-8 Wake Forest team. Sounds pretty bare!

If you remove the years with Ford's players, the era was hideous, especially when looking at conference results!
 No.2
RazzMaTazz		 01:52 AM
07/08/2008
If the cupboard was so bare when Bowden arrived, and it's so much better now, then one would expect Clemson to be doing much better now than in Bowden's early years. But the stats don't show that.

TB's ACC record 1st 2 years: 11-5 (.688)
TB's ACC record last 2 years: 10-6 (.625)

1st 2 years vs AP Top 25 finishers: 1-7 (.143)
Last 2 years vs AP Top 25 finishers: 1-6 (.167)

ACC place finish including tiebreaker criteria:
1st year: 3rd of 9 teams.
2nd year: 3rd of 9 teams.
2 years ago: 6th of 12 teams.
Last year: 4th of 12 teams.

I'm just not seeing evidence of the bare cupboard or marked improvement.

I don't remember Jim Grobe complaining about how bare the cupboard was, or how bad the facilities were, or how many starting players were injured as won the ACC at a tiny, private basketball school. I'm guessing Grobe would have been happy to swap with Bowden for cupboards, facilities, academic requirements, stadiums, fanbase support, etc.
 No.3
swingaway		 07:56 AM
07/08/2008
Razz:

This article is not about marked improvement - stay on subject. This is about the level of the program that was acquired by Tommy Bowden - not the state of the program today.

You should certainly understand that you cannot compare the conference finish from 9 years ago with today. Add Virginia Tech, Miami and Boston College to our schedule 9 years ago and the results would have been even worse. Scholarship limits are also very different now as compared to then. Practice time is limited, more oversight, etc...

In Tommy West's last year, we lost to a 4-7 Duke team and a 3-8 Wake Forest team. We beat one ACC team. How in the world can you dispute that we had minimal talent?

Finally, the writer of this blog used 9 years of history to inidicate the cupboard was not bare. How can you use the success of 1990 and 1991 to determine what Bowden acquired in 1999. Those players were gone!
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